RockinpQuarterHorses.com Reviews
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October 16, 2008
Rebuttal
Quite the story...
I actually read your complaint prior to calling and making arrangements to meet Casey Palmer personally. My work as a mounted enforcement officer for a major department in Los Angeles prompted me to do some research. I found your complaint and thought it was an awful story, if true.
Prior to meeting with Casey and Jodi, I admit I had my guard up. Any person qualified enough to call themself a "Horseman" takes nothing for granted. I heard his side of the story which was quite different. I found Casey and Jodi not to be the "uneducated horse traders" that some have labeled them. I found them to be kind, hard working people. I bought my 5 year old daughter a "Casey Palmer Horse". He had some bumps and bruises from the long ride from Oklahoma however, after approx. 4 hours, I too purchased my horse without a vet check. I've relied on my experience and common sense to be my guide through the years.
I would NEVER make any deal or arrangement to purchase a horse by mail. If you do, you're a fool. If you don't have the eye, go find someone that does. I will be posting my picture of "Little Joe" in uniform on Casey's web site soon (www.rockinpquarterhorses.com)
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June 27, 2008
Misrepresented Horse
This is a warning for anyone looking to purchase a horse from Casey Palmer or Jodi Bagwell of Porum, Oklahoma. They also list themselves out of Dallas, Texas and even occasionally in California. They are d.b.a. (doing business as) Rockin P Quarter Horses or www.rockinpquarterhorses.com.
Casey Palmer advertised a 12 year old kid safe horse on the www.Dreamhorse.com website and also on www.agdirect.com (unsure of any other websites he may have used also). I contacted him and spoke with him about the mare. I let him know that this was going to be the first pony for a 7 year old child. He assured me that the pony was bomb proof (bombproof), completely safe, anyone can ride, could be used as lesson horse, etc., etc. I specifically asked him if the horse had ANY health issues and if she was sound. He assured me that she was "completely healthy and sound" and that he would not be able to find one this nice again for a couple of years. He also told me several times "You will not be disappointed in this horse". After several very believable conversations with Mr. Palmer, I agreed to pay him $1000 for the pony and he assured me that he would be able to have her shipped to my home for approximately $200 within 1 to 5 days.
Each time I phoned Casey asking what the status was for shipping the mare - it was difficult to get a hold of him and when I finally did he always had a story. He told me that his fiancee (Jodi Bagwell) had found transportation and he would get back to me with the details. After not hearing from him again, I called Jodi only to find out (that what he had said was not true) and that she had no idea what he was talking about and had not made any such arrangement with anyone . Then, he tells me "a friend" could transport the horse for approximately $500 (more than double what he originally told me it would cost). Finally, after several weeks of this, I resorted to arranging my own transportation, which was substantially higher than he indicated it would be.
The transportation company arranged to pick up the horse, but had to wait for several hours (past the agreed pick up time) for Mr. Palmer to finally bring the horse to them putting them behind schedule for their other clients.
When the pony finally arrived at my location (less than 24 hours later), she was not even completely off the trailer when I noticed a horribly inflamed, running, swollen eye oozing yellow pus. Her entire nose and muzzle were also completely covered in a blistered, scabby sort of rash, bleeding in some spots. I immediately phoned my veterinarian (who arrived in less than an hour) and informed me that the ponies left eye had CANCER and that the right eye was not far behind. He indicated that this had been going on for at least a year - possibly longer. She was also running a fever, very underweight and had a slightly clubbed foot. Now, mind you, he had a couple of photos of her that I had seen but all taken at a distance impossible to discern the issue with her eyes.
I immediately phoned Mr. Palmer to let him know about my shock in seeing her in this condition and asked him to contact me so that we might resolve this. He refused to answer his phone or return my call. I sent him an email that evening with a photo of the pony's eye and asked how this could have possibly been overlooked when I had specifically asked if she had ANY health conditions. He again refused to reply, not even to express surprise or concern of any sort for the pony.
The following morning the pony was severely ill with pneumonia. It took extensive care and intravenous antibiotics to bring her through. (I have documentation for all of this) Her eye tissue was biopsied and confirmed that it was cancer (again, I have the report from the pathologist). She will most likely lose her left eye to the cancer in the very near future at a cost of upwards of $2, 000 to me (this will in the end be closer to approximately $4, 000 with the additional vet expenses - once again, I have written estimates from my veterinarian). Her right eye is also exhibiting similar symptoms, so we are unsure what her prognosis will be. Of course, if her right eye continues to follow the same course as her left eye, we will be forced to humanely euthanize her. Imagine the horror to a young child just receiving their first pony.
As far as the pony being labeled completely sound, I have already indicated that vet said she had a clubbed foot. She has also required special trimming on all four of her feet (my farrier said it was one of the worst cases she had seen and immediately moved the pony to her list of priorities for fear of her suffering permanent leg damage). She has had to trim the pony in several separate appointments to avoid doing too much at once. The pony is still showing signs of considerable heel pain in both front feet (possibly navicular???) I have not had her X-rayed yet (due to the other extensive health issues that we are already dealing with). Mr. Palmer had also told me that he was a farrier (or as he spells it "ferrier") and that her feet were in "perfect" condition. My complaint, however, is regarding the eyes. This is just additional information indicative of her overall condition.
I had opted not to do an additional vet check due to the fact that my own vet told me that it really doesn't do me any good. If the vet is a friend of the seller, or just plain incompetent, my only recourse would be to sue the veterinarian in the state it was done. I also see vet checks as a tool to uncover UNOBVIOUS or hidden issues or conditions that cannot be observed without the expertise of a vet. I had concluded (due to Mr. Palmer's untruths about the mare's condition) that there were no obvious conditions observed by Mr. Palmer that needed to be further examined by a vet. Had Mr. Palmer or Ms. Bagwell indicated that there was ANY sort of inflammation or issue with her eyes, I would have either requested a vet to do a further evaluation of her eyes or (most likely) terminated the transaction altogether.
Now, as to Mr. Palmer's claims of the pony being bombproof, kid safe and a perfect beginner or lesson horse. This also appears to be untrue. I have been riding horses for 25 years and the mare was wanting to take off with me. Mind you, this is NOT asking her to canter or run barrels, but just at a walk. She spins, throws her head, and had to be held tight in the bridle just to keep her at a walk. I have not even attempted to trot and canter her - as she was barely responding to me at a walk. Hardly appropriate for a kid's horse. But then again, should I be surprised at this point? She also pins her ears and gets extremely pissy when being tacked up. Even when cinching her slowly, she turns her head towards me as if she wants to bite - but has not as of yet. I am not comfortable putting ANY child on this horse, experienced or not. At this point, I would not put a beginner adult on her either.
After the pony's arrival, I phoned an equine attorney who informed me that a seller MUST inform a buyer of a pre-existing condition and make no effort to conceal it or it is fraud, regardless if an additional vet check is done or not. I have 5 years to put together a lawsuit should I choose to do so. I will happily email photos of this pony's eye if you are curious if there is any possible way that Mr. Palmer or Ms. Bagwell could have overlooked her condition. I believe that even the most novice horse person would be able to easily identify a problem. Mr. Palmer allegedly trains and sells horses for a living. How could he possibly have missed this?
During my discussion with the equine attorney, she asked for the name of the seller. When I informed her that it was Casey Palmer out of Porum Oklahoma, she immediately indicated that she was familiar with his name, as she has another client that also recently had a fraudulent sale with him. I have personally spoken with this other individual and I am sure that she would be happy to relay her unfortunate dealings with Mr. Palmer also. She essentially informed me that Mr. Palmer sold her a horse that was also supposed to be guaranteed to be safe, no buck, etc., etc. (it appears that most of their horses that are posted all have similar descriptions). Anyway, apparently this horse was dangerous and bucked every time he was asked to canter. This person lost a great deal of money trying to resolve the horse's issues (vets, chiropractors, equine massage therapists and even a professional trainer). After the horse broke the back cinch of the trainer (bucking) the trainer recommended that she get rid of him, as the trainer did not believe the horse would ever be safe. She lost a great deal of money because of this transaction with Rockin P Quarter Horses, and was disturbed and infuriated to hear that I was now also in a difficult situation.
To reiterate, I feel that there is no possible way that the conditions of this pony's eyes could have possibly been overlooked. When Mr. Palmer delivered the pony up to be transported, he specifically told the driver to "leave this fly mask on." The driver obeyed these orders and did not see the condition of the pony's eyes until just shortly before delivering her to me - and was appalled at her condition. The driver indicated that he had only seen horses in this poor of condition being hauled to slaughter.
Mr. Palmer and Ms. Bagwell knew fully well that this pony was to be a child's first horse - per my discussions with them. If she survives, she will be a one eyed horse which can be dangerous for an experienced rider, and certainly not ideal for a young rider just learning to ride, although after riding her, I find that she is an unsuitable mount for a child - even with BOTH eyes. Again, with both eyes exhibiting the same symptoms, we are unsure of her prognosis.
I feel that the lack of ethics and professionalism exhibited by Rockin P Quarter horses is deplorable and unforgivable. There were absolutely no attempts to contact me, offers to exchange the horse, offer for a full or partial refund, to simply apologize, express any sort of surprise at the news, or even check the welfare of the pony.
It is irrelevant to me whether Mr. Palmer and Ms. Bagwell knew fully well of the condition of the horse or they were too uneducated about horses to know that a horse with an eye condition as severe as this needs immediate medical treatment. Either way, I find it very disturbing that they continue to advertise and sell horses that are not as they are represented to be. I would hope that this should be enough to deter anyone from purchasing a horse from them. Obviously, I feel that this horse was grossly misrepresented as does the other buyer that I have spoken with. And, if an equine attorney immediately recognizes this seller's name I don't see that as a positive indication of their business transactions, do you? In sum, if any one is looking to purchase a horse from this business, I highly recommend that you take the facts of my situation (and the other persons) into consideration and make a wise decision about whether you should purchase or not. I would hate to see yet another person in the same difficult emotional and financial situation that our family has been put into.
Numerous other parties have contacted me since posting this - with stories much worse than this one. Beware.
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June 27, 2008
Terrible experience
I bought an 8yr old grade quarter horse gelding from Casey Palmer and Jodi Bagwell. I saw him on their website and I first was asking about a different horse on there and was not getting a response by email so I called and I talked to Casey about what I wanted in a horse. I told him that I wanted a horse that I could trail ride on, that was safe because we have kids in our neighbor hood and was hoping to get a horse that the kids could ride. I told him that I did not want one that would buck or do any thing like that. That I had been bucked off and needed a completely broke horse. He said that the one that I was thinking about would not be as good and this other one that he had, named Tinker. I said of yes I did see him on there as well. He said this horse is great. You can ride him anywhere and do anything. You can pull him out of the pasture and get right on and he will be the same every time( well i guess that is right he bucks every time). He said I had some other people out today that looked at him but they have not made a decision and it is first come first serve. So I said ok i will get him. He said you need to wire the money to me and I will email you the info and I even have someone that can bring him to you in the next few days and it will be about $300. So I got he email with the wire info and went right to the bank to wire the money... $2250, that did not include the shipping. I would pay the shipper when he got here. So that was April 5th, Then I kept trying to get a hold of Casey, no answer no return calls no reply emails... at this point I am getting a bad feeling. so I finally get a hold of them on April 8th say they have not gotten the shipping done but he is working on it. In the mean time I am emailing all of his references on his website and I am getting responses yes good ones but of course no one is going to put people that are not happy with them on their website for a referral. In the mean time I am asking for new pictures and he says I will as soon as sister comes home from school. He says that his friend will be shipping him to me in about a week but still no price on shipping. Finally he says that his friend will be $600 to bring him out but I will have to meet him about an hour from my house cause he does not like to go to colorado. so I am getting quotes from other shippers and get a quote for $300 so I tell Casey that I will do that and make sure he has his coggins and health cert. So we finally get it settled for pickup i think it was on the 13th of April. He gets him on the trailer and then the next day April 14th he gets off the trailer. The shipper says I am glad he is here because that place was nasty and he was the best looking horse on the place. I am pleased that he does look good, expect his feet which needed done very badly, he says that he is a farrier so why were they not done. He is over weight but I rather a few extra pounds than to thin. So I put him in his pen and feed him and then call casey to let him know that he arrived safe and that I was going to ride he later and see how he is, had to get to work not long after he got home.
So I got to ride him I think it was the next day or day after. I took him into the round pen and lunged him and he looked good so I had by husband there and i said ok I am going to get on and walk and that was fine and then we trotted and that was ok but as soon as i asked for the lope he kicked out. so then i talked to my husband and said ok lets try this again. walk trot lope he kicked out again. So I got off and called casey and told him what happened. He acted very surprised. I said I am going to have the massage therapist out and chiropractor he did just travel from Oklahoma to Colorado, maybe he is tired from the trip. So they came out I think the same day. He did need it he was out in several places. So they said let him rest a day and see how it goes. So i did and he did the same things. so then i called my trainer and took him over there and had him work him and see what was going on. He said well could be his feet and he said he is acting like he is not used to the altitude. So give him 2 weeks to get used to it and then see what happens. So I got the farrier out and he trimmed him and said I think that you need to take him to hate vet and get him lameness checked. So I took him and got him checked and xrayed came back ok so then I thought well his teeth need done maybe that is it. so got is teeth done and his sheath that the vet was one of the worst that he had ever seen. so after all that and the 2 weeks off I took him back to my trainer and he did the same thing so I left him at the trainer for the month. I would go check on him and he would say that he was not changing and could not figure out why. so finally at the ed of the month we finally figured out that the horse had no work ethic and did not care if he pleased oyu or not and that he would not change with out a lot more time if ever. He also told me that he bucked so hard one day that he broke his back cinch. So I call Casey and he says we will trade horses and that he will fond a good one that I can be happy with.
So begins the trading saga.
I keep asking him about ones he has on his site. no answer to calls, no answer to emails, no return calls nothing. Finally I think that we have a horse that will work and I am calling to get the coggins and stuff on that one he has and find out when we can get it done and all of a sudden... Casey says "I was riding Jasper today and he did the same thing so we better keep looking" very convenient if you ask me that was June 13th. then it just keeps going on not answering the phone no emails and then when i want a video of one... too much water too much rain no that one wont work... until he finds one that he says will be great but he will be an additional $1900. I say no way I am not paying more and so I tell him come get him and give me my money back... no i can not do that we will keep looking. No I will put him on my website and sell him for you. send me pictures and i will get him on right away so i do and then it is into August before he finally gets him on his site. I told him that if things were not settled soon I was going to put him in a catalog sale. well on and on it went. So finally called a Lawyer and she told me to sell him and then go after him for the difference. I had even been asking him for a refund of half the purchase price and he had been refusing that. Well finally I did take him to that sale and I got $575 for him.
I did finally get $500 from him but I am still out a lot on him. I am not any means happy with him.
Than I get an email from the lawyer that I had talked to before and there is another lady that has had a problem with Casey and she would love to talk to me about what happened to me and so I call her and find out her story.
So what I am saying is please be very careful if you get a horse from him that everything is as promised and get things in writing just in case.
I m not saying that he does not have some good horses but he has at least 2 out there that were not as promised.
There have been more people contacting us with problems as well.
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February 3, 2008
Misrepresentation of a horse!
This is a warning for anyone looking to purchase a horse from Casey Palmer or Jodi Bagwell of Porum, Oklahoma. They also list themselves out of Dallas, Texas and even occasionally in California. They are d.b.a. (doing business as) Rockin P Quarter Horses or www.rockinpquarterhorses.com
Casey Palmer advertised a 12 year old kid safe horse on the www.Dreamhorse.com website and also on www.agdirect.com (unsure of any other websites he may have used also). I contacted him and spoke with him about the mare. I let him know that this was going to be the first pony for a 7 year old child. He assured me that the pony was bomb proof (bombproof), completely safe, anyone can ride, could be used as lesson horse, etc., etc. I specifically asked him if the horse had ANY health issues and if she was sound. He assured me that she was "completely healthy and sound" and that he would not be able to find one this nice again for a couple of years. He also told me several times "You will not be disappointed in this horse". After several very believable conversations with Mr. Palmer, I agreed to pay him $1000 for the pony and he assured me that he would be able to have her shipped to my home for approximately $200 within 1 to 5 days.
Each time I phoned Casey asking what the status was for shipping the mare - it was difficult to get a hold of him and when I finally did he always had a story. He told me that his financee (Jodi Bagwell) had found transportation and he would get back to me with the details. After not hearing from him again, I called Jodi only to find out (that what he had said was not true) and that she had no idea what he was talking about and had not made any such arrangement with anyone . Then, he tells me "a friend" could transport the horse for approximately $500 (more than double what he originally told me it would cost). Finally, after several weeks of this, I resorted to arranging my own transportation, which was substantially higher than he indicated it would be. The transportation company arranged to pick up the horse, but had to wait for several hours (past the agreed pick up time) for Mr. Palmer to finally bring the horse to them putting them behind schedule for their other clients.
When the pony finally arrived at my location (less than 24 hours later), she was not even completely off the trailer when I noticed a horribly inflamed, running, swollen eye oozing yellow pus. Her entire nose and muzzle were also completely covered in a blistered, scabby sort of rash, bleeding in some spots. I immediately phoned my veterinarian (who arrived in less than an hour) and informed me that the ponies left eye had CANCER and that the right eye was not far behind. He indicated that this had been going on for at least a year - possibly longer. She was also running a fever, very underweight and had a slightly clubbed foot. Now, mind you, he had a couple of photos of her that I had seen but all taken at a distance impossible to discern the issue with her eyes.
I immediately phoned Mr. Palmer to let him know about my shock in seeing her in this condition and asked him to contact me so that we might resolve this. He refused to answer his phone or return my call. I sent him an email that evening with a photo of the pony's eye and asked how this could have possibly been overlooked when I had specifically asked if she had ANY health conditions. He again refused to reply, not even to express surprise or concern of any sort for the pony.
The following morning the pony was severely ill with pneumonia. It took extensive care and intravenous antibiotics to bring her through. (I have documentation for all of this) Her eye tissue was biopsied and confirmed that it was cancer (again, I have the report from the pathologist). She will most likely lose her left eye to the cancer in the very near future at a cost of upwards of $2,000 to me (this will in the end be closer to approximately $4,000 with the additional vet expenses - once again, I have written estimates from my veterinarian). Her right eye is also exhibiting similar symptoms, so we are unsure what her prognosis will be. Of course, if her right eye continues to follow the same course as her left eye, we will be forced to humanely euthanize her. Imagine the horror to a young child just receiving their first pony.
As far as the pony being labeled completely sound, I have already indicated that vet said she had a clubbed foot. She has also required special trimming on all four of her feet (my farrier said it was one of the worst cases she had seen and immediately moved the pony to her list of priorities for fear of her suffering permanent leg damage). She has had to trim the pony in several separate appointments to avoid doing too much at once. The pony is still showing signs of considerable heel pain in both front feet (possibly navicular???) I have not had her X-rayed yet (due to the other extensive health issues that we are already dealing with). Mr. Palmer had also told me that he was a farrier (or as he spells it "ferrier") and that her feet were in "perfect" condition. My complaint, however, is regarding the eyes. This is just additional information indicative of her overall condition.
I had opted not to do an additional vet check due to the fact that my own vet told me that it really doesn't do me any good. If the vet is a friend of the seller, or just plain incompetent, my only recourse would be to sue the veterinarian in the state it was done. I also see vet checks as a tool to uncover UNOBVIOUS or hidden issues or conditions that cannot be observed without the expertise of a vet. I had concluded (due to Mr. Palmer's untruths about the mare's condition) that there were no obvious conditions observed by Mr. Palmer that needed to be further examined by a vet. Had Mr. Palmer or Ms. Bagwell indicated that there was ANY sort of inflammation or issue with her eyes, I would have either requested a vet to do a further evaluation of her eyes or (most likely) terminated the transaction altogether.
Now, as to Mr. Palmer's claims of the pony being bombproof, kid safe and a perfect beginner or lesson horse. This also appears to be untrue. I have been riding horses for 25 years and the mare was wanting to take off with me. Mind you, this is NOT asking her to canter or run barrels, but just at a walk. She spins, throws her head, and had to be held tight in the bridle just to keep her at a walk. I have not even attempted to trot and canter her - as she was barely responding to me at a walk. Hardly appropriate for a kid's horse. But then again, should I be surprised at this point? She also pins her ears and gets extremely pissy when being tacked up. Even when cinching her slowly, she turns her head towards me as if she wants to bite - but has not as of yet. I am not comfortable putting ANY child on this horse, experienced or not. At this point, I would not put a beginner adult on her either.
After the pony's arrival, I phoned an equine attorney who informed me that a seller MUST inform a buyer of a pre-existing condition and make no effort to conceal it or it is fraud, regardless if an additional vet check is done or not. I have 5 years to put together a lawsuit should I choose to do so. I will happily email photos of this pony's eye if you are curious if there is any possible way that Mr. Palmer or Ms. Bagwell could have overlooked her condition. I believe that even the most novice horse person would be able to easily identify a problem. Mr. Palmer allegedly trains and sells horses for a living. How could he possibly have missed this?
During my discussion with the equine attorney, she asked for the name of the seller. When I informed her that it was Casey Palmer out of Porum Oklahoma, she immediately indicated that she was familiar with his name, as she has another client that also recently had a fraudulent sale with him. I have personally spoken with this other individual and I am sure that she would be happy to relay her unfortunate dealings with Mr. Palmer also. She essentially informed me that Mr. Palmer sold her a horse that was also supposed to be guaranteed to be safe, no buck, etc., etc. (it appears that most of their horses that are posted all have similar descriptions). Anyway, apparently this horse was dangerous and bucked every time he was asked to canter. This person lost a great deal of money trying to resolve the horse's issues (vets, chiropractors, equine massage therapists and even a professional trainer). After the horse broke the back cinch of the trainer (bucking) the trainer recommended that she get rid of him, as the trainer did not believe the horse would ever be safe. She lost a great deal of money because of this transaction with Rockin P Quarter Horses, and was disturbed and infuriated to hear that I was now also in a difficult situation.
To reiterate, I feel that there is no possible way that the conditions of this pony's eyes could have possibly been overlooked. When Mr. Palmer delivered the pony up to be transported, he specifically told the driver to "leave this fly mask on." The driver obeyed these orders and did not see the condition of the pony's eyes until just shortly before delivering her to me - and was appalled at her condition. The driver indicated that he had only seen horses in this poor of condition being hauled to slaughter.
Mr. Palmer and Ms. Bagwell knew fully well that this pony was to be a child's first horse - per my discussions with them. If she survives, she will be a one eyed horse which can be dangerous for an experienced rider, and certainly not ideal for a young rider just learning to ride, although after riding her, I find that she is an unsuitable mount for a child - even with BOTH eyes. Again, with both eyes exhibiting the same symptoms, we are unsure of her prognosis.
I feel that the lack of ethics and professionalism exhibited by Rockin P Quarter horses is deplorable and unforgivable. There were absolutely no attempts to contact me, offers to exchange the horse, offer for a full or partial refund, to simply apologize, express any sort of surprise at the news, or even check the welfare of the pony.
It is irrelevant to me whether Mr. Palmer and Ms. Bagwell knew fully well of the condition of the horse or they were too uneducated about horses to know that a horse with an eye condition as severe as this needs immediate medical treatment. Either way, I find it very disturbing that they continue to advertise and sell horses that are not as they are represented to be. I would hope that this should be enough to deter anyone from purchasing a horse from them. Obviously, I feel that this horse was grossly misrepresented as does the other buyer that I have spoken with. And, if an equine attorney immediately recognizes this seller's name I don't see that as a positive indication of their business transactions, do you? In sum, if any one is looking to purchase a horse from this business, I highly recommend that you take the facts of my situation (and these other individuals) into consideration and make a wise decision about whether you should purchase or not. I would hate to see yet another person in the same difficult emotional and financial situation that our family has been put into.
Unfortunately, since posting my story, I have had several other people contact me that have also had misfortunate dealings with them.
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